Kendall and Rebecca discuss all things tractors... our own involvement with equipment, our own experiences with tractors, how they are involved in our lives now, and what they represent in the context of women in agriculture.
Kendall Kunelius 0:09
Welcome to this episode of Shared Soil, a podcast dedicated to creating community, honoring challenges, and encouraging personal and professional growth for all people in agriculture. My name is Kendall Kunelius, and I'm a field specialist working in the area of agricultural business management.
Rebecca Dube 0:27
My name is Rebecca Dube and I provide program support and technology to the various specialists of UNH Cooperative Extension. How are you today, Kendall?
Kendall Kunelius 0:37
I'm beyond excited to be recording this episode. How are you?
Rebecca Dube 0:43
I'm great. I'm looking forward to this episode. I think today's topic on tractors is going to be really exciting to talk about. I know it's one of your favorite subjects. So tell me Kendall, what is your first memory of a tractor? I know that mine started when I was young, and it's not quite a tractor per se, mine's a little different, in that mine was on a ride-on mower. Which learning to do as a child, I promptly drove into an apple tree, and tended the front. So certainly, knowledge of tractor safety and correct uses of it is a very important topic for every young woman to learn. How about you?
Kendall Kunelius 1:37
Yes, I also have some disastrous memories driving a lawn tractor, thank goodness no injuries were involved. I would say though, that probably my very first and maybe favorite memory of driving a tractor; when I was four years old, we moved to a town called Barnett, Vermont - very, very rural. My father decided to build our house, he cut the timber off the land, and then milled it there and then built a beautiful post and beam house. But obviously, there's a lot of site work involved in that. And so I have a very special picture of this moment, when I was sitting on my father's lap in the back. He's on a backhoe, not a tractor, but you can just see this huge grin on my face. And I'm sitting there with my dad and he's operating the backhoe. I think that's really a perfect illustration of how I feel every time I get on a piece of equipment or a tractor. That's my very favorite memory, sitting there and spending so much time driving tractors when I was a little kid.
Rebecca Dube 2:42
That's great Kendall. That brings me to another question. In that, we talked about the ride-on mower and the backhoe versus a tractor. What really constitutes a tractor? What makes a tractor not an ATV or some other piece of equipment?
Kendall Kunelius 3:00
That's a great question. There actually is a pretty formal answer for that in the sense that a tractor is considered - it's not considered a driving vehicle. I'm gonna say that and there's obviously some caveats to that. But it's a piece of farm equipment. It is meant to be operated and used in an agricultural setting. There's a reason why on highways and some roadways, there's a sign that says no tractors. That's because it's not a car, it's a different kind of vehicle. So tractors are, I mean, they could be two-wheel drive or four-wheel drive, but they're really designed to be the workhorse of your farm. They could have a loader, they could have different attachments on the back. They could be very, very big, like a 100-115 horsepower tractor, which is like a production ag-type vehicle. And then you could even have something down to 10 horsepower, like a teeny-tiny little ride-on lawn mower or subcontract track subcompact tractor, which is maybe 20 horsepower. They come in all different shapes and sizes. But most importantly, they're not really a road-worthy vehicle. They're not instructables driven on the road by your everyday driver.
Rebecca Dube 4:15
So this isn't a podcast about cars, then, it's about tractors.
Kendall Kunelius 4:19
No, yeah, today we're specifically talking about a tractor.
Rebecca Dube 4:25
So why do we want to talk about tractors?
Kendall Kunelius 4:29
Well, I mean, I don't have an excuse to never talk, not not talk about a tractor! I will always talk about tractors! You know, I think because, like everything on a farm, there's an inherent sense of danger. I mean, obviously, you need to be very aware when you're operating this kind of vehicle, that it takes a lot of practice. But my grandmother always used to say (my family owns a farm in Connecticut), she said if everything on the farm could be accomplished from the seat of a tractor, there will be nothing left to do. And that's because driving a tractor is just a lot of fun. They're so useful. They're so handy when you have the right piece of equipment at the right time. We all know that in farming, time is money. So they really help in terms of farm efficiencies. And of course, they have their own costs associated with them. But more than anything, I think a tractor gives the operator a sense of ability to accomplish. It gives you an avenue to use your your brain, your critical thinking skills, and it saves your - I don't want to say sweat equity, because it's still work driving around on your farm accomplishing things - but it gives you the ability to accomplish something greater than just hand labor would accomplish. So I think there's a lot of things about why we would want to talk about a tractor, and I think approaching the topic of women talking tractors is a really interesting thing to talk about. Because it's not necessarily about the tractor itself, the equipment itself, it's this sense of why is it so taboo for a woman to be operating a piece of equipment? I think that could go for anything, right? This may be the one moment where we'll expand this to all vehicles. How many bad jokes do we hear like, "Oh, she's a woman driver, watch out for her," or, "Oh, of course, she can't back up because she's a woman." There's a lot of really pretty hurtful side comments and jokes that everyone makes. We joke about ourselves as women all the time, too. But I think that it's a stereotype that shouldn't be perpetuated. And I think it's something that the more we talk about it, the more we realize how much more we could be accomplishing, or how much we've been held back because we maybe have an inherent fear of operating something or we just feel like we can't drive a tractor because it's not our place.
Rebecca Dube 7:01
Yeah, and then speaking to that, I think the image in your mind a lot of times about women operating tractors is that they're not going to have the strength for it, or it's such a large piece of equipment, they're not going to be able to handle that. Can you talk a little bit about, is that really ever the case? Or how much strength or how much is really involved to operating a tractor?
Kendall Kunelius 7:30
I think the way I want to answer that question, is this. It's entirely about the situation you're in and the piece of equipment you're operating. It's not so much about physical strength. Yes, you have to climb up and down to get into vehicle. And some, obviously, smaller tractors are easier to enter than a really huge, 100 horsepower, ag-type tractor. But ultimately, it's all about this. You wouldn't want to be driving a huge tractor on a one acre farm, right? So that's going to be a really uncomfortable situation. But I think the point I'm trying to make is that many tractors are built to be ergonomically friendly and easy to operate. So there's literally no reason as to why a woman would not be capable of operating a tractor. I say that also saying, in terms of capability, physical disabilities aside as well, because there are some ag manufacturers that do cater to and they can accommodate physical disabilities in design of tractors. Agrability and Agri Safe have some excellent resources as to where folks can access that. So in terms of overcoming this stereotype, or this myth that women aren't able, it's simply not true. You can turn a steering wheel just like anyone, gender and identity identity aside. There's a glass ceiling I think we all face there or a glass wall that we run into sometimes thinking, "oh, I've been told I shouldn't do this for so much of my life," but then when you stop and really start to think about like, why, why? What is the actual pinpointed reason as to why I would be incapable of pushing in a clutch or shifting into gear or turning the tractor around or raising or lowering the scoop? And you really start to reassess.
Rebecca Dube 9:35
And perhaps they're just not taught, as is so often the case, that they weren't taught at an early age or at any age in how to operate it and once they know, it becomes much easier. Are there any safety protocols specific to a tractor?
Kendall Kunelius 9:54
So many. So, so many. Yeah, it's interesting because I think the best tool a woman can use as her brain. I think we're built to be critical thinkers, excellent problem solvers and critical thinkers. And what I think is really helpful about that is we can assess the situation a little bit more easily. So if you're thinking about safety protocols or just anything with a tractor, using your best judgment. Obviously, knowledge is power. You want to be well aware of what you're getting yourself into when you get on tractor, or work around a tractor or hook up a piece of equipment. But the more you know about the safety pieces about operating tractor, the better. There's actually a lot of great curriculums out there that are designed to take you through step-by-step all the safety considerations. Purdue University has Gearing Up for Safety. It's a free online curriculum that you can access and print and download. If you want to learn about teaching tractor safety, or just anything to do with tractor safety, there's a lot of great YouTube videos available online. Or you can always call your local county ag agent and say, "Hey, I want to learn how to drive a tractor. Can you send me some great resources?" And we'll be happy to do that. In terms of safety, also thinking about situational awareness, that comes to mind, knowing where you're going to be driving, when you're going to be driving, are there pets and/or small children around? What's the kind of ground and the surface you're driving on? Large animals, fences, what kind of equipment are you towing behind you? All that kind of stuff. Safety is one of those subjective terms, right? Because it's safety for you and safety for everyone around you, and safety for your equipment. It's expensive. So making good decisions, that means that you're not going to be beating up too badly on your brand new tractor that cost you $50,000 is also probably a great way to stay safe.
Rebecca Dube 12:04
Right. And certainly in New England soil, which is so rife with stones and rocks. That's an issue that people really need to think about as they're working their tractor through the soil, the possibility of encountering a rock so soon.
Kendall Kunelius 12:22
My answer to that would be there's great attachments that go on the front of your tractor, like a root rake or something that can help you pick those stones out. I think that every farm is unique in terms of their terrain and their challenges. And to that, I would say also, we're pretty hilly, there's not a lot of really flat land in New Hampshire. So a great practice, or a great option that you can take advantage of is making sure that your tires are what's called loaded or weighted. And that's something you can ask your dealership or the place you purchased your tractor from for a reference. Oftentimes, there are services that will come out and fill your back tractor tires with beet juice, it's sugar beet juice, because of it's high sugar content, so it won't freeze in the winter, and then it won't throw your tires off balance. They used to use calcium chloride. They don't. I say "they". The tractor manufacturers or the people who service tractors do not use calcium chloride anymore, because it can corrode the inner surface of the tire and it will cause it to explode.
Rebecca Dube 13:30
Well, I'd always rather have sugar beet juice in my tires anyway. Something sweet like that, that's always good, right? Hey, when you were talking about the dealerships? Can you talk a little bit about how does a woman even start with with tractor shopping? What's the best way to go about that?
Kendall Kunelius 13:50
Well, that's a great question. So I've gone to a lot of dealerships. I've done a lot of observation to see how my husband was treated when shopping versus how I was treated with shopping. And that's not because I am suspicious of something, it's truly just because it's an interesting experience to see how the salespeople have been trained. Because it's no secret that when you go car shopping, the salesman always shakes my husband's hand first and that I just think is really interesting. Right? The handshake, the greeting is always directed towards the man first. So I always say when you're going tractor shopping, I would go by myself or take a female friend with me, because I want that salesperson's attention. I want to be very clear that I'm the one here purchasing the tractor or I'm interested in driving and seeing the tractors and the equipment that's available. Now having said that, let's just talk about basic human decency. And just say, if you're a paying customer and your money is green, then you should be expecting service, the appropriate customer service for the type of tractor that you're purchasing, or the type of equipment that you're purchasing. And I don't care what you're purchasing, it's anything. Everyone should be a good human being if you're in that line of work. But more than that. I often do my research ahead of time, because I want to know what I want. And that's a great question to back up and think, what do I need for my farm? Let's just say that you've determined that you are looking specifically for a 50 horsepower tractor. You'd really like to have a cab on that tractor, because you might be working in inclement weather, or you might be spraying pesticides or herbicides, and that's gonna help keep you safer. And you want a front end loader, because you plan to be using that front end loader to be moving manure or rotating compost. You also want to make sure that you get - you want a three point hitch mower for the back so that you can maintain your pastures. So we have our checklist, our wish list, to say this is what I really want out of my tractor, because it matches my needs on my farm. So when you have that, and you approach a dealership, and you say this is what I'm looking for, what do you have that gets me the closest to this? And stick to your guns. Most dealerships really do have the best intention in mind, they do want to get you into the right piece of equipment. And that goes back to what I was saying with the safety thing, too. You don't want to be using a piece of equipment that's not designed for what you're trying to use it for. You wouldn't be using a huge tractor on a three acre farm, it's just doesn't make sense for you. But what you have on your list really does make sense.
Rebecca Dube 16:43
So keeping that list with you really helps you keep on target, as they may try to upsell something. You can stick to what your actual needs are.
Kendall Kunelius 16:53
Right. And I would also say don't feel like you have to get a sales person involved right away. I often like going in and just walking around exploring the options, looking at the tractors from first glance. Because that also emulates what's going to happen with any potential farm employees if you have employees on your farm. They're gonna want a tractor that's easy to use, too, and easy to encounter. So think about this from the perspective that everyone who would be using that piece of equipment. That's just general knowledge about what you want to purchase, but I like to go and look at the tractors instead on the tractors myself. And then I can ask the salesperson for specifics. Like, how much does this tractor cost? Does it fit my budget? Also, does it come with a cab? Or what other attachments are available for the front or the back of the tractor? Tell me a little bit about the maintenance on the tractor. That's the other question that I always ask the dealership. Is this tractor easy to get parts for? Is it easy to maintenance? Is it something I can change the oil by myself? Or what kind of service does the dealership offer if there's something that is catastrophically wrong with with the tractor itself? What if you get it home and it doesn't work?
Rebecca Dube 18:12
True, those are all great points. I know that it helps me to have stuff written down. It's like going to the doctor's office, you want your questions written, or else they get forgotten in the excitement of what you're talking about or looking at, and certainly a tractor could could derive that excitement as you're looking to get something new.
Kendall Kunelius 18:32
I would also say stick to your list, but be open-minded also to the other features and functions that you might find. There's a lot of different options for the transmission in the tractor. If you think "Well, I really just want a gear tractor, high-low range, very, very simple, clutch, etc, etc." But you want it for mowing, and you go to the dealership, and the salesperson says, "Well, you know, you really might consider a hydrostatic clutch because that is going to make going forward and then quickly transitioning to going backward a little bit easier. It's going to be much better to just drive around straightforward. If you really only want it for one or two purposes, that may be the best way to go." So also trusting that if they're a knowledgeable person, and they're a salesperson who's worth their salt, they should also help you improve on the idea that you have and get you the right type of vehicle for what you're looking for. It is their job to know that stock inside and out.
Rebecca Dube 19:31
Do you recommend going to more than one dealership and trying out different models of different brands for your tractor?
Kendall Kunelius 19:37
That's a great question. I laugh because there are so many people who are brand-loyal, right? People are like "Oh, I bleed blue, I'm such a Ford New Holland person." Or someone's like, "I would never have anything except for a green John Deere sitting in my yard." So I personally would say yes, check out your other options. Different tractor manufacturers make things different, especially ergonomic considerations. I think it's, more important than the color of the tractor. I'm gonna say that. That could be controversial, but I'll say it. So if this is a tractor, you're going to be spending a lot of hours sitting in and you're going to need this for a lot of work, then buy something that's comfortable. Or buy something that you could replace the seat or customize in a certain way to fit your body size and position. The other thing we talk about a lot with our Women in Ag programming is the different shapes and sizes of our bodies - of everyone's bodies. But it is a known fact that actually agricultural equipment is designed for men. It's not really designed with women's body proportions in mind. So it's very important when you go shopping to pick a tractor that feels really great to you and is adjustable for the size and shape of your body. That's very, very important. So color aside, you may be really loyal to one particular brand or another and that's fine, but I would still say just shop around. Absolutely. The other consideration when you're purchasing a tractor is at what point should you purchase the tractor? Right? So in our last episode, Kelly McAdam talked a lot about how women farmers are a very prevalent group and how are we helping them understand the value of their farm? I talk about value, but I mean in the business aspect. At what capacity is your farm viable? What revenue streams do you have? I think the idea of mechanization is not always something that comes to the forefront of our mind right away. So for me, though, if I was to be running my own farm, I'm saying, I would really have a hard time finding labor. I think that's a very common theme with every farmer, women or otherwise. Every farmer is saying "I just cannot find labor." It may be time to mechanize. If you have enough income on your farm, and if you can justify the cost, then this may be the time. So when you're purchasing a tractor, thinking about the functions that you need it for. If you just don't have enough people to go out and weed then you can get a cultivator, a tow-behind cultivator for your tractor. If you have a farm that is very scenic, very beautiful, and maybe you have a lot of parking space, and it lends itself well to agri tourism, what does it look like to get a tractor that can safely pull a hay wagon? If you could do tractor-drawn wagon rides, that's an excellent revenue source. And of course, you need all the insurances and stuff to go with it. But that could replace a different revenue stream on your farm that required a lot more human labor. For example, this year, instead of growing carrots, you're going to do tractor-drawn wagon rides. And you're going to bring in more money, and it only requires one person. Maybe you're offering this five or six weeks out of the year, rather than needing to employ someone all season long. So thinking about how that tractor is going to actively give back to you in a revenue sense is important and also how it's going to limit the amount of physical labor that you're going to need on your farm. Not because you don't want to hire people, but because you're really having a hard time finding people to hire. So a tractor is something that could change the structure of your business for the better or, potentially for worse, if you are not well set up or if you aren't set up perfectly to accommodate the tractor that you have. That's the other thing. You could purchase a tractor that's not appropriate for your farm. I also want to throw in here too. I personally am a fan of purchasing used tractors. I think if you find a really good one, tractors were built to last. It's absolutely true, the saying, "they don't make them like they used to." When you look at the old model tractors - my husband has a John Deere 50. That tractor is designed to do its job but it was designed to be worked on. The parts are easily replaceable, or they were. I mean, obviously that tractor's very old now, 70 years old. But the point being that it's open on the side, the parts were meant to be accessed and maintained and worked on. It was designed to be a piece of equipment that would last a very long time. Another tractor that you really commonly see that's very handy, are Ford 8-N and 9-Ns. They made a lot of them. They're great little tractors for just getting around the farm. They're easy to operate, they're nimble, they're actually, interestingly enough, I think most of the 8-Ns are gas instead of diesel. That's another consideration we can talk about. But they're easy to maintain. And they're easy to find parts for because there are so many of them out there. So don't discount the idea of going to a dealership that also has used tractors. Or if you're somebody who's very mechanically inclined, shop around. See if you can find one that's been sitting in a field for a few years that just needs some new fluids and new tires and some maintenance and upkeep, and then it's going to be good as new. But tractors are one of those neat farm pieces of equipment that are designed to be continued in use for years.
Rebecca Dube 25:44
Where can people reach out? What are some venues that they could look for used tractors within, if they were interested in buying a used tractor? Would they go to Craigslist? Would they go to - ?
Kendall Kunelius 25:58
Well, to be honest, there's a lot of tractors out there that are just sitting in fields. You can drive around all of New England, and somebody's got some nice old something hanging around. But again, it just depends on what you want. If you have a family member that has an old tractor, it's worth talking to them. You could go to a dealership and see if they have a farmer that comes in often asking for parts. Unfortunately, I don't find Craigslist to have very savory people all the time. But if you feel confident that the post you're looking at or the tractor you're looking at is legitimate, and it's not a scam, then I would say just do your research and go for it. But always make sure that no matter where the situation the tractor is, really do your research ahead of time and see what the troubles with the tractor were, what the strong points of the tractor were. There's so much content on the internet nowadays. That's going to at least get you pointed in the right direction for what you need. I also love watching tractor restoration videos on YouTube, because it gives you some really keen insight into the issues that the people who are working on the tractors are running into. So if you need a tractor, that's gas instead of diesel, then figure that out. Again, those tractors need different maintenance than a diesel tractor. But that may be what you're more - you're working on a combustion engine instead of a diesel engine or compression engine. It's just a little different mindset. But no matter where you're shopping for that tractor, again, I go right back to that whole thing of make sure that it's an appropriate vehicle. You're not just buying it because it's convenient and available.
Rebecca Dube 27:46
Great, thank you Kendall. You have such a wealth of information about different aspects to think about when just getting started in with a tractor.
Kendall Kunelius 27:56
Yeah. We talked about maintenance, maybe it would be also great to chat very quickly about maintenance in your tractor. If you're going to be investing in this kind of piece of equipment, having a keen understanding of how to keep it going for as many years as you can, is important. I think one of my favorite stories is when my husband and I got married my my father actually gifted us a tractor from our farm in Connecticut. It wasn't being used, it was properly stored. It's a 1983 Ford 1900. Just a little 25 horsepower tractor, but the sentimental value was what was important and it was a great starting point now
Rebecca Dube 28:42
Now that's a wedding present!
Kendall Kunelius 28:43
It is a wedding present! I guess my point in saying all that is that because it had been on a family farm, we knew the maintenance that had been kept or in recent years not kept up on the vehicle. So we had an idea of what parts may need to be replaced in the future. When we pulled it out of the storage area that it was in we just we replaced all the fluids basically and primed. Took the air out of the - I mean I won't get to it, doesn't really matter. But what matters is the fact that you can maintenance a tractor and it will continue to run for years and years and years, and it will run well. If you're investing in a new tractor things like your oil changes, things like watching for dry rot on your tires, keeping up with your hydraulic fluid, your hydraulic hoses to make sure they haven't cracked. That's one of the most common issues that I've seen in old tractors are hydraulic hoses that are covered by a canvas or rubber protector and you have to take that off to see the condition of the hoses underneath. I have seen a hydraulic hose burst because it was cracked and fatigued and it finally just gave out. And that's very dangerous. It's extremely dangerous. The fluid is hot, hot, hot, because it's under pressure. And it goes everywhere, they literally explode because of how much pressure that hydraulic hose is under. And when I say hydraulics, that's like if you have a loader on your tractor, and it's raising and lowering pallets or unloading something, it's a point that you really want to make sure you're looking after. So maintenance aside, I think maintenancing a tractor is a great way to get to know the piece of equipment. And the better you know your piece of equipment, the more efficient and handy you can be with running that on the farm.
Rebecca Dube 30:40
And certainly maintenance on your tractor is protecting your investment by extending its life and having less repair costs. And thus being as you mentioned, safer to the driver and all around it by preventing accidents as much as possible.
Kendall Kunelius 30:57
Yeah, and actually, I'm glad you mentioned preventing accidents. Tractors, old tractors, you know we talked about buying a used or secondhand tractor. One of the biggest things that they lack are seatbelts and/or roll over protection systems. A ROPS, or rollover protection system, is something that all new tractors will come with, whether it's the bar that goes up over the back of the tractor, or a cab is considered a rollover protective system. Very, very important to have. Rollovers are a huge issue in tractor safety. So especially here in New England, where it's hilly, or you mentioned the rocks earlier in the field. If you hit a rock going at a certain speed, you definitely could tip the tractor then. Important to remember though, is that actually on a tractor, you don't always wear your seatbelt. If you do not have a ROPS, rollover protection system, you do not wear a seatbelt. And that is because the tractor ROPs is designed to suspend the driver with the seatbelt on so they don't get crushed. However, if you don't have that suspension system, that ROPS to hold the end of the vehicle up, what you want to do is be able to get free of the vehicle. So the good news is for older tractors, though, many of them are made of steel, there's a lot of solid metal components, and it is possible to get some ROPS that will retrofit onto those tractors. If not, they've got some great weld points. So you can always be maintenancing and working on them that way. But looking at your ROP system, making sure you have a seat that either does or does - you know every seat should have a seat belt. But installing an aftermarket seatbelt can also be a great option to protect yourself. And you talked about insurance policies, making sure that you've done everything you can to make that vehicle as safe as possible.
Rebecca Dube 32:56
Great. Well, thank you, Kendall. That's a lot of great talk about tractors and I know that there's so much more information that we could continue to cover. But I think we're gonna wrap it up for today. Is there anything else you want to add?
Kendall Kunelius 33:13
Other than go out and take a little spin around on your tractor and have some fun? No, I I think I would definitely say keep an eye out for our future tractor safety workshops. We don't have one planned at the moment, but it is something that we offer and we like to offer. And also if you ever have any questions about how to figure out what type of tractor to use for your farm or to purchase the kind of equipment you're looking at, don't hesitate to reach out to your local ag agent. They should definitely be able to point you in the right direction for some resources or information.
Rebecca Dube 33:47
Thank you for tuning into this episode of Shared Soil. And we look forward to discussing another farm topic for women in agriculture in our next episode.
Kendall Kunelius 33:57
Shared Soil is a production of University of New Hampshire Cooperative Extension an equal opportunity educator and employer. Views expressed on this podcast are not necessarily those of the university, its trustees or its volunteers. Inclusion or exclusion of commercial products in this podcast does not imply endorsement. The University of New Hampshire, US Department of Agriculture and New Hampshire counties cooperate to provide Extension programming in the Granite State learn more at extension.unh.edu.
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